Hydrogen Not The Answer, Say MPs
By Paul Homewood
Some of us have been highlighting this for years!
Plans to require that all new boilers are able to run on hydrogen within a few years are unrealistic, according to a powerful committee of MPs who have warned that hydrogen is “not a panacea” for cutting carbon emissions.
MPs on the parliamentary Science and Technology Committee say the clean-burning gas is likely to play a limited role in the future energy system, given the practical challenges of producing and handling the gas cleanly at large scale.
They argue huge questions still need to be answered about the potential deployment of the gas, and highlight “conflicting views” on the role it could play in domestic heating, given the merits of electric heat pumps instead.
Hydrogen is currently a niche product used in chemical production and oil refining, but politicians around the world hope it can replace fossil fuels in uses ranging from heating to transport, as it does not produce emissions when burned.
However, the committee argued that in practice this was likely to be limited to uses where other options are unsuitable, or in areas which are close to hydrogen production hubs.
“It seems likely that any future use of hydrogen will be limited rather than universal,” they said. “This limited – rather than universal – use of hydrogen should inform Government decisions.
“For example, we disagree with the Climate Change Committee’s recommendation that the Government should mandate new domestic boilers to be hydrogen-ready from 2025.”
Its report comes as on December 12, the Government set out proposals to require all boilers installed after 2026 to be hydrogen-ready. The Committee said it was “unconvinced” that hydrogen will be able to play a widespread role in heating homes by 2026.
Quite apart from the fact that hydrogen is horribly expensive to produce and ridiculously energy inefficient, we are still faced with the mammoth problems of storage, distribution and adapting of appliances. The whole idea of relying on hydrogen in bulk, as opposed to a niche application, has always been a non-starter. And if, as the Committee says, it is a worse solution than even heat pumps, it really is not a solution to anything.
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NOT A LOT OF PEOPLE KNOW THAT 
The hydrogen bubble has burst, thankfully before it became too big and some idiot started playing with matches.
I completely agree that hydrogen is not a viable substitute for natural gas in domestic boilers. However, I suspect that the boiler manufacturers are arguing for it so as to get the Govt to postpone its upcoming ban on gas boilers in new houses. By offering to make their boilers convertible to hydrogen they hope that they can continue to sell these boilers and see off the fitment of heat pumps instead. They also can appear to be green. I applaud this initiative as a pragmatic way forward, and we probably shouldn’t be criticising hydrogen too much, even though we have quite correct doubts on its viability.
So what is plan B then? Surely at this stage in the Net Zero madness, some 14 years after the climate change act was passed, we would have some affordable and efficient alternative electricity storage systems actually working. Blowing up our coal fired power stations before viable alternatives were proven, does seem rather short sighted.
No, I don’t think it was short-sighted, I think it was a deliberate ploy to force the issue. The people who made that decision had ulterior motives, IMO, and it had nothing to do with moving to green energy. People like Huhne, Deben and Miliband (at the head of a very long list of wreckers) have a lot to answer for – and nothing to be proud of.
Totally correct Harry (in my honest opinion) and I also think that the big black spider at the centre of this web is Deben.
Nuclear fusion. The ex-May advisor Timothy – you know, the moron that advised her to hold an election – says that all will be well based on the news from the USA that we can generate one thousandth of the energy put into the fusion system. With advisors like him, no wonder May was doomed.
Hydrogen cavern storage project. More £££££.
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/dec/18/sse-begins-work-on-hydrogen-storage-cavern-on-yorkshire-coast
Also in the Express. Too small and unaffordable.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/science/1711383/sse-builds-underground-hydrogen-storage-energy-site-swerve-national-grid-blackouts
Given hydrogen’s known propensity to explode at the slightest provocation, what could possibly go wrong? 🤡
And with a high explosion pressure.
And having only a third of the Energy content of Methane at the same Temperature and Pressure.
Typical crap grauniad reporting. No indication of cavern storage capacity ineitther cu m or kWhrs. Just a breathless statement hat the power rating of something vaguely associared with the project is 35 MW about peak capacity of7wind turbines
The internal physical volume of St Paul’s Cathedral is ~150,000m^3.
For comparison, the physical volume of our Rough natural gas storage facility is …. “…approximately 10 km (6 miles) long by 3 km (1.8 miles) wide and varies from 24 metres to 36 metres in depth.”
So approx 900,000,000m^3, or ~6,000 St Paul’s Cathedrals.
However, hydrogen has only 30% of the energy content of 1m^3 of natural gas, so Rough would store 14,000x more energy (at the same pressure).
No wonder the Graun doesn’t report how much energy the SSE project would store.
Based on your figures JP, with hydrogen having about 3kWh per cubic metre at STP, we have 150,000 x 3 = 450,000kWh divide 1,000 = 450MWh total storage capacity. Convert that to electricity through a gas turbine probably results in <250MWh electricity in storage.
Hi Ray.
Both hydrogen and natural gas are stored at pressure.
The Graun chose to use an STP volume.
Prior to 2016, Rough stored gas at approx 3,500psi / 240bar. Since it’s returned to operation this Autumn, it’s operating at a reduced pressure – but its working volume still stores ~9,350GWh
One presumes similar underground caverns would operate at a similar pressure for hydrogen.
More from SSE:
In 2021, SSE Thermal and Equinor announced that they were collaborating on plans for one of the world’s largest hydrogen storage facilities at Aldbrough. The planned Aldbrough Hydrogen Storage facility could be in operation by early 2028, following the proposed start of commercial operations for the Pathfinder project in 2025, with an initial expected capacity of at least 320 Gigawatt hours (GWh) supporting the growth of hydrogen in the Humber.
In addition, SSE Thermal and Equinor are developing Keadby Hydrogen Power Station, which could be the world’s first major 100% hydrogen-fired power station, with a peak demand of 1,800MW of hydrogen. The two companies are also exploring hydrogen blending opportunities at the jointly-owned Saltend Power Station, while SSE Thermal is doing so at its Keadby 2 Power Station.
So the storage for the main project could have held 1TWh of methane, or about one larger LNG tanker load. We were getting through over 4TWh/day during the recent cold snap. The source of hydrogen for the main project, will be split between SMR hydrogen and electrolysis. It is unlikely that the power station would be more than 1GWe. The storage duration is just over 1 week at maximum fill and use.
The project has its own website
https://www.aldbroughhydrogen.com/
Lots of subsidies involved of course. Watch for the three card tricks that they put in place under REMA.
No mention of where the hydrogen is going to come from or how much CO2 will be generated in the process? It’s always nice to have all the facts when embarking on new projects.
“In 2021, SSE Thermal and Equinor announced that they were collaborating on plans for one of the world’s largest hydrogen storage facilities at Aldbrough”.
I’m glad that I have moved from Felixstowe
And just like wind, what’s the likelihood we still pay when they can’t produce H?
On the day this story appeared in Times and Telegraph they both ran ( unfounded) stories about landlords panicking about the need for properties to get EPC grade C by 2025. So with hydrogen off and heat pumps useless for the majority of the housing stock, exactly how does the government propose they move forward with the ‘energy efficiency’ drive for households?
I think we need to go into Gallic Shrug mode. A few years ago, about 2011, the French Government decided that all Fosse Septique should be upgraded to modern environmental standards, but that owners should pay. This was no small undertaking costing similar amounts to heat pumps. Most French householders just shrugged and said I can’t afford it. A similar tactic with heat pumps and/or hydrogen might be a start.
I think now that it has to be done when a house is purchased but am not certain about that, perhaps a current French resident could enlighten us on the current situation.
A confrontation between “Just Stop Oil” and “No to Heat Pumps” demonstrators could be interesting, whose side would “Insulate Brtain” be on?
Sold a farmhouse in France in 2014
and came to an arrangement with the purchaser that we would split the cost of the new fosse (Septic tank) to allow the sale to go ahead
Compulsory requirement.
Thanks Gray,
that’s what I thought. However until a house is sold the shoulders keep shrugging?
…. but the ignorant Oxford PPEs will not listen to those of us who understand this stuff. Nor will they have to live with being held responsible for their folly.
We just have to watch helplessly as the train crashes.
It would be nice if MPs on the parliamentary Science and Technology Committee managed the extraordinary challenge of adding two plus two and concluding that Deben’s Committee for Climate Change is blatantly unfit for purpose and should be not only abolished but investigatedb by Special Branch for corruption and malfeasance.
Do any members of that committee have anything more than a GCSE in any science subject? Are any of them capable of any independent though or even the most basic of internet searches for background?
Good question.
I have no doubt that the Drax employee member may have the moral compass of a perverted sewer rat, but will be capable of adding up faster than IBM.
Excellent point, Will. In less than 60 seconds, I find that UK emissions are dwarfed by other states. UK is right in there with Turkey, Pakistan, and Thailand.
For which ministers are willing to commit suicide.
Martin have you heard of Globe International? Its stated aims when it was founded (1990 or 1992) were to invite politicians from every country and to get those politicians to promote fighting climate change and sustainability. The president was Lord Deben and the vice president was Barry Gardner, didn’t they do well? They now control the Climate change committee and the policy of this country.
Yes indeed.
Two really nasty pieces of work. Funded by the usual Yank GangGreen Bazillionaires, I think.
I hope it isn’t making heat pumps seem like a good idea
MPs do not know what they are talking about, as usual. If, as seems
likely, the UK ends up getting most of its electricity from small scale
nuclear then local production of hydrogen at reasonable cost is possible
which could feed into local gas grids as Japan is planning with Toyota
promoting hydrogen fuel cells for its cars and trucks. Given the data
from Valentina Zhakarova on the coming mini ice age from 2026 until
2060 it is clear that the current program of wind and solar power will
not work as under suh conditions power requirements for survival with by
orders of magnitude higher than now and iced up wind turbines and solar
panel will not cut it.
And Toyota have given up on hydrogen cars in the UK with Shell closing down its fuelling network.
I’d much rather have a hydrogen fuel cell car than a battery car.
I can refuel it in seconds and it could have a long range.
Best of all I don’t need to spend tens of thousands turning my garden into a charging area.
You can get one for a mere £53,105 in the UK (includes the government deduction). Bargain – not 🙄
https://www.ecocars4sale.com/hydrogen-cars-new-vehicles
I rather fancy a Roman style battle chariot with a dozen assorted GangGreen MPs in the traces.
And a well made cat o’nine tails.
Fun!
The Net Zero obsession is shaping up to be the government’s biggest and costliest bungle yet, and we will pick up the tab by even lower standard of living.
“Quite apart from the fact that hydrogen is horribly expensive to produce and ridiculously energy inefficient, we are still faced with the mammoth problems of” . . . a government that has the power to mandate it.
“The people who made that decision had ulterior motives, IMO, and it had nothing to do with moving to green energy.”
Yet they still have the power to mandate it.
“but the ignorant Oxford PPEs will not listen to those of us who understand this stuff”
Yet they still have the power to mandate it.
“Do any members of that committee have anything more than a GCSE in any science subject? Are any of them capable of any independent though or even the most basic of internet searches for background?”
Yet they still have the power to mandate it.
“MPs do not know what they are talking about, as usual.”
Yet they still have the power to mandate it.
The fascist state, exercising control over the people, will continue and grow as long as the people argue the merits of an idea, rather than challenge the government’s authority to mandate the idea.
As the commenters above show, the government isn’t competent to make such decisions. Yet they are given the authority to make them, an obvious strategic blunder. When people die this winter because of the government, DEMAND they get out of energy management. For starters, demand they repeal CCA 2008. The Overton window will open as wide as the number of deaths.
When you get that, go after Net Zero. Seriously, UK killing people over emissions as China builds out their coal infrastructure is Kabuki Theatre.
” The Overton window “…”Kabuki Theatre” That’s an example of what I like about this blog – I learn new words and terms every day.
It would help if MP’s, and other assorted nobodies, could ask the correct question in the first place. But they cannot. Some incorrect answers include:
heat pumps
windmills
solar panels
EV subsidies
battery storage
Some correct answers may include:
more fracking
more well drilling
more carbon dioxide
more coal
heat pumps
windmills
solar panels
battery storage
The market, being what it is, will result in these being made in China. Much of UK emission shedding is just pushing in a balloon; it’s just going to pop out in China. Except for UK misery, nothing changes.
Even better would be if MPs started saying “climate panic” and “net zero” are also not the answer to REAL issues.
I completely agree that hydrogen is not a viable substitute for natural gas in domestic boilers. However, I suspect that the boiler manufacturers are arguing for it so as to get the Govt to postpone its upcoming ban on gas boilers in new houses. By offering to make their boilers convertible to hydrogen they hope that they can continue to sell these boilers and see off the fitment of heat pumps instead. They also can appear to be green. I applaud this initiative as a pragmatic way forward, and we probably shouldn’t be criticising hydrogen too much, even though we have quite correct doubts on its viability.
Anything the corrupt Climate Change Committee recommends should be immediately zapped; including the Committee.
Hydrogen heating should not be blocked because it is expensive/dangerous etc. It should not even be considered; as being totally unnecessary and useless for the purposes intended.
Why politicians waste time on it beats me.
The driving force for the hydrogen debate is NZ but I suspect that not very far into the future the driving force for all energy will be shortage of natural gas. OK, so Russia has lots but gas fields are relatively short-lived. Morecambe Bay finished years ago, so did Groeningen. Qatar’s North Dome has been delivering for forty years or more. US shale is reported to be levelling off. I like the idea now emerging with SMRs to locate the generation local to big users. Maybe hydrogen (from reforming of light distillate) could have a place to provide 20% of the fuel gas reasonably local to big users (it certainly can’t be “blended” into the national gas grid).
Groningen has been producing for 60 years. Production is only being reduced because of seismicity, not because the field is exhausted.
The seismicity story is a lie, there is no record of any dangerous seismicity caused by fracking anywhere on the planet.
Dung: What has fracking got to do with Groeningen? Anyway you should stop posting nonsense and just delve into the internet for extensive firm factiual data about damaging seismic events from fracking in the US especially in the south west.
Vernon If Groningen is a bog standard gas field and there is no fracking then I am guilty of a genuine mistaken assumption and apologise for that. I know more about fracking related seismicity than you ever will and saying I post nonsense is a good example of pot and kettle ^.^
Reply to Dung.
Groningen is a conventional gas field.
https://www.offshore-technology.com/marketdata/groningen-conventional-gas-field-netherlands/
Gas extraction resulted in subsidence above the field. From 1991 this was also accompanied by earthquakes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groningen_gas_field
Are our dim MPs starting to wake up, and actually think? One can only hope so.
Dung et al: The simplest of all searches re Groeningen, Expedia, provides the following “Gas extraction resulted in subsidence above the field. From 1991 this was accompanied by earthquakes and this led to damage to houses and unrest among residents. It was decided to phase out gas extraction from 2014 onwards. The Groeningen Field is expected to be closed between 2025 and 2028 with the possibility of bringing this forward. The reinforcing operations for damage settlement as a result of the earthgquakes are in progess slowly. The Nationa;l Ombudsman called this a national crisis in 2021.”
So can you please stop pushing nonsense.
By the way, in my original caution I should have added that the original “North Sea Gas” fields in the Southern sector were exhausted years ago and those in the Nothern sector are mature and new finds are deeper, further offshore, and more expensive.
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