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Next time, buy a proper car, Isabel!

October 1, 2018

By Paul Homewood

 

H/t Dave Ward

 

 

Virtue signalling Isabel Hardman finds out the hard way why nobody wants electric cars, other than a few eco nuts.

 

From the Mail:

 

 

My electric car drove me to distraction …instead of Scotland! Nissan Leaf’s range is just 160 miles and as ISABEL HARDMAN discovers, good luck finding a charging point that actually works

 

 

 

Read the full article here

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6225039/Nissan-Leafs-range-just-160-miles-good-luck-finding-charging-point-works.html

 

Just one final comment. The distance from Cumbria to Wigtown is about 150 miles, and to Gretna about 70 miles, so it is plain you cannot rely on anything like the 160 miles claimed

97 Comments
  1. Ian Magness permalink
    October 1, 2018 7:15 pm

    Hilarious!
    And I love the comment along the lines of: “it cost me 25 grand to buy this small and basic car but HEY! zero road tax!
    The title of her book is priceless too. Mind you, the evidence is that the latest, younger lot can’t rid themselves of AGW groupthink any more than those presently leading the parties, and there’s no difference between the parties on (insane) energy policy. What a mess!

    • Dave Ward permalink
      October 1, 2018 7:59 pm

      “The evidence is that the latest, younger lot can’t rid themselves of AGW groupthink”

      It’s not just the younger generation – I’ve given up trying to convince my sister (late 50’s) that carpeting the country with turbines and solar panels is a complete waste of time. She just “shuts off” in the normal way of someone brainwashed by the left…

  2. Joe Public permalink
    October 1, 2018 7:29 pm

    • Dave Ward permalink
      October 1, 2018 7:55 pm

      It must be a newer “Plug-In” Prious – the original version has no such capability, but I call BS – I bet it’s a “staged” picture. According to this test:

      https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/toyota/prius/97262/new-toyota-prius-plug-in-hybrid-2017-review

      “Run the batteries dry and the quiet petrol engine kicks in without interruption”

      • It doesn't add up... permalink
        October 1, 2018 11:39 pm

        Run the batteries down and you can’t even start the petrol engine. Whilst the vehicle will switch to petrol if it is in motion, it won’t fire up the engine to top up the battery if it is getting too low while parked. Of course the same applies to a regular car too.

  3. October 1, 2018 7:55 pm

    Sad to see the Mail go over to the dark side following a change of ownership, the article is mostly confected outrage at the govt for not providing a smooth path for virtue signalling “greens”. As someone who hates waiting even a few minutes in a petrol queue, no way would I wait for hours to get to the front of an electric one, which is the inevitable outcome of the propaganda/subsidy push for electric cars, which is no doubt driven by some hidden EU directive.

    • dave permalink
      October 1, 2018 8:23 pm

      “…confected outrage…”

      You are right. It is just a whine from the silly air-head that the rest of us haven’t ponied up 100 billion pounds for new infra-structure – which is the REAL cost of her noddy car.

    • Phoenix44 permalink
      October 2, 2018 8:55 am

      And then wait hours for the car to be charged!

      If you run the numbers around car range and charging time, the idea that EVs can work is just absurd. Journey times go back to the stagecoach era at best.

    • Gerry, England permalink
      October 2, 2018 1:58 pm

      EU Directives are never hidden – it is just that people here don’t bother to read them. MPs certainly avoid them as to admit they exist shows how little is left for them to rule over. Take the Grenfell fire – building regulations are governed by the EU so calls to change them were ignorant.

  4. RogerJC permalink
    October 1, 2018 8:07 pm

    I wonder how far she would have got with the lights, wipers, heater, heated rear window and radio all on

    • October 1, 2018 9:02 pm

      You can manage; I drive a Vintage land Rover and it has zero luxuries! It has zero Road Tax too.

      • Bitter@twisted permalink
        October 2, 2018 8:24 am

        My 1962 Jaguar, has radio and CD player😁

    • Ipf Meiklejohn permalink
      October 2, 2018 7:38 am

      Yes, on a cold dark winter’s morning when you need the heater to defrost the Windows and the battery in not too good because of the low temperature. Help!

      • Duker permalink
        October 3, 2018 3:44 am

        Its not commonly known but its the summer heat that kills batteries, cold mornings just buries what is almost dead.

  5. Dave Ward permalink
    October 1, 2018 8:24 pm

    Some interesting comments on the “Zap Chat” section here:

    https://www.zap-map.com/charge-points/

    Quite a variety of problems reported, and far from what anyone used to visiting a conventional petrol/diesel filling station would expect…

    She said: “But if I’m on a long journey, I need to stop and top up the battery” – well, also from the Zap-Map site, is this:

    “The Nissan Leaf is fitted with a 6.6 kW on-board charger as standard, for all applications apart from Rapid 50 kW DC. This means that even when connected to a fast charger with a higher maximum output, the Nissan Leaf 40kWh will only be able to accept up to 6.6 kW.”

    Rapid 50kW 40 mins – 0-80%

    Fast 22kW 6 hours – 0-100%

    Fast 7kW 6 hours – 0-100%

    Slow 3kW 14 hours – 0-100%

    So unless you find a 50kW charger you ‘aint going to “Top Up” very quickly…

    • sean2829 permalink
      October 2, 2018 12:51 am

      There is another problem if you use a fast charger. The battery gets quite hot. So if you are on a long journey, you may charge up quickly once but all subseqent charges are at lower rates.

    • Simon from Ashby permalink
      October 2, 2018 9:46 am

      My Local Tesco filling station has 12 pumps. If it takes 5 minutes to fill and pay (slow because they are all pay at pump) then to provide the same through put for 40 minute charges as the petrol pumps there would need to be 96 charging stations.

      If they are all in operation at 50kW, taking (by my calculation) 208 amps then the total current is 19,968 amps, which is alot.

      Its a long time since i did this stuff so correct me if I’m wrong.

      • Gerry, England permalink
        October 2, 2018 2:00 pm

        Just imagine the throughput of a busy motorway service station and think how much space and power would be required. It is a total fantasy world.

      • yarpos permalink
        October 5, 2018 10:37 am

        just convert some drive in movies, if you have any

  6. John F. Hultquist permalink
    October 1, 2018 8:26 pm

    My car, a 2016 Subaru, will go about 500 miles on a tank of gas.
    I can refill it in about 6 minutes, + 4 more to get off and back on the highway.
    This summer, I’ve encountered just 2 pumps that had issues. Others were only 20 feet away.
    Each of those took an extra 2 minutes.
    I don’t need gizmos or a smart phone to help me locate a station, as they are easy to see and get too.
    image of a real gasoline store

    And per RogerJC (above), I often have the lights, wipers, heater, heated rear window and radio all on. If it is warm, the A/C might be on.

    If Isabel Hardman wants to visit in central Washington State, Ill take her on a few trips that will enlighten her views. The landscape views will be spectacular, also.
    Search images for: sunrise viewpoint mount rainier
    Elevation at the parking lot is 6,400 feet.

    • October 2, 2018 12:32 pm

      If she would like a shorter flight, I’ll invite her to visit West Virginia. I can drive her up to Dolly Sods, elev. ca. 4000′, on a good gravel road. We can look over the Eastern Divide east into the Ridge & Valley Province. Then we can come back by way of Blackwater Falls State Park with spectacular views of the 65′ falls and the gorge below. This time of year the north-facing side will be green and yellow due to hemlock and birch, but the other side will be a riot of yellow, golds and reds from the maples, etc. When we get back to Morgantown, I will still have a half tank of gas left in my Ford Freestar van and plenty of refill choices. There are even a lot of gas stations in Canaan Valley between Blackwater and the Dolly Sods turn.

      • Gerry, England permalink
        October 2, 2018 2:01 pm

        And you can always put some spare fuel in the back. Try that with batteries.

  7. October 1, 2018 9:12 pm

    huh…

    check out the Telegraph’s e-Golf on long term test – it hasn’t all been smooth silent running. There’s been some charging comedy on long runs – see the account of a London Llanelli return trip (Sept 11th post).

    It might seem hard-hearted but oi larfed at the hunt for a charger at Swindon.

    a comment
    \\ £19 for 120 miles? My 2.0-litre petrol would only cost me £16.30. //

  8. markl permalink
    October 1, 2018 11:21 pm

    Early adopters of anything can expect to be guinea pigs but EVs have been around for well over a decade in mass production. The fact that the point of charge owner can’t make enough money to provide reliable service is a serious problem. Wait until Europe gets really into EVs while ramping up wind and solar and removing fossil fuel and nuclear plants. Then you can add availability of electricity to the problem and waiting hours to charge won’t seem so bad if you can get it at all. But not to worry, they’ll just charge more for it and blame you for not planning your trip well enough. And just think how much you’re saving the earth for your children.

    • Bitter@twisted permalink
      October 2, 2018 9:31 am

      More likely “ crash- test dummies”.
      Emphasis on the dummies.

  9. John Smith permalink
    October 1, 2018 11:47 pm

    The reality of life in the real world does hit home hard once one gets out into it. I live quite close to Wigtown and I can see the place from my elevated home on the hills, but driving there and back is a 50 mile round trip. I have never noticed any electric car charging points around here and given the population (lack of) and the need for vehicles that will go anywhere in any weather, I am not surprised that I don’t see many electric cars. As an electrical engineer, I think the idea of electric cars sounds great, but a dose of reality is needed outside of the larger cities.

  10. It doesn't add up... permalink
    October 1, 2018 11:52 pm

    If she thinks she had a bad experience now she should think about trying to do a longer journey on Christmas Eve when everyone is doing the same thing, and we have say 1 million EVs on the road. Then imagine it with 20 million. By then you will find that you get to the head of the queue only to find surge pricing for power at £2 per kWh. I noted the Telegraph journalist paid £10.36 for 35 kWh, or about 35p/kWh for a 5 hour charge More than double the already heavily jacked up rates we pay for domestic power.

  11. Japan T permalink
    October 2, 2018 12:22 am

    Electric cars are not new. Some are around a hundred years old. There are reasons they didn’t catch on.

    The most surprising parts of her story are her ignorance. Why is she surprised at how the time it take to travel long distances given the time needed to recharge?

    “Clean” she says. Where does she think the electricity needed to charge her car comes from?

    • dave permalink
      October 2, 2018 1:59 am

      “…where does she think the electricity…comes from?”

      A caressing summer breeze turning a darling little windmill somewhere a long, long way away.

      • Japan T permalink
        October 2, 2018 2:11 am

        No need to read her book, “Why We Get the Wrong Politicians”. The reason is, because people like she vote.

      • It doesn't add up... permalink
        October 2, 2018 2:00 pm

        There are lots of windmills in the Solway Firth and the Scottish Borders. Much harder is to work out what they are producing, unless you guess with the help of Grid watch.

    • October 2, 2018 12:34 pm

      I just saw the source of that electricity on Saturday in the form of an absolutely HUGE loaded coal barge being pushed by a plucky little tug down the Ohio River at Wheeling, WV. I was waiting to go inside with the other volunteers to work the Trump Rally that evening.

  12. Japan T permalink
    October 2, 2018 12:53 am

    She is lucky that the charging station she finally used didn’t have a vehicle needing a full charge pulled in. Luckier still that there wasn’t a line of cars needing charged.

  13. October 2, 2018 5:14 am

    Irony is also that the EV owners are demanding free charging stations at work here in Kalifornia, while employees without coal fired cars command no such perks.

  14. October 2, 2018 5:42 am

    Hello fossil fuels fanatics! How are you all doing today? Enjoying your very own echo chamber?

    My next car will be a plug-in hybrid, which will allow me to do 90% of my driving on electricity coming from a nuclear power plant. What are you all going to do about it? How will you prove my cosmic wrongness?

    Do some basic math. To extend European oil consumption to the entire world, the world oil production needs to double. For the North American consumption level, it needs to quadruple. You really think it can, and economically? Keep on dreaming.

    • October 2, 2018 6:29 am

      Who says we are fossil fuel fanatics? I have no choice where I live and with my life style but to use a petrol car. I have no choice but to use oil to heat my house (supplemented by wood). I would love to get most of my electricity from nuclear power and would love to see all the wind turbines and solar farms removed. But with the idiots in charge I have no choice about that either.

    • tom0mason permalink
      October 2, 2018 7:35 am

      @mf
      “Do some basic math. To extend European oil consumption to the entire world, the world oil production needs to double. For the North American consumption level, it needs to quadruple. “

      I note that you supply no figures for that comment probably you’re a low knowledge type, with a belief in peak oil soon or something.
      Maybe you don’t realize that gasoline can be made from coal, and diesel engines can run a very wide variety of oils/fat mixtures including the original fuel for that type of engine, rape seed oil.

    • Japan T permalink
      October 2, 2018 9:00 am

      Mf

      You do the math. The gas station I worked at while in college serviced thousands of vehicals a day. Actually, I worked five gas stations. The three along the interstate each filled thousands of vehicles a day. The two stations in towns away from the highway serviced “only’” hundreds a day.

      How many chrging stations would be needed?. How many acres of land for parking all those vehicles for the hours it takes to recharge them. Where will the occupants of all those vehicles spend their time waiting for their vehicles to recharge?

    • Bitter@twisted permalink
      October 2, 2018 9:36 am

      Maybe.
      But imagine how much harder everything will be in a renewables-powered future.
      I’ll take my chances with good old fossilised solar energy😁

    • Harry Passfield permalink
      October 2, 2018 9:46 am

      MF (interesting blog name…) How do you know your car is charged from nuclear-generated electricity? Anyway, being a hybrid much of its charge is from your hated fossil-fuels.

      As for extending oil-consumption on the scale you suggest, that will take many tens of years, even a century, so the shock to production won’t be so great and, anyway, transport technology will have moved on a bit by then.

      Maybe, seeing as you are in the US, you’ll be driving a car powered by fracked gas. Oh dear.

    • A C Osborn permalink
      October 2, 2018 11:31 am

      mf, a very good choice, but of course being a hybrid you are still dependent on Fossil Fuels are you not?

    • October 2, 2018 12:35 pm

      I would call us realists. We deal in reality.

    • JCalvertN permalink
      October 5, 2018 9:53 pm

      mf,

      How can you be prove that the current that charges your vehicle really did come from a nuclear power station? Is there a separate ‘Nuclear Only’ national grid? And separate ‘Nuclear Only’ electricity wires down every street in the country? Or do you have a special ‘electron filter’ that can somehow admit nuclear generated current and block dirty fossil-fuel generated current?

  15. October 2, 2018 8:07 am

    Got an EV? Then you need one of these – your own personal generator
    http://tinyurl.com/ybnfx2wo

    Charging points not working? No problem fill her up with petrol!
    http://tinyurl.com/ycqpvmsr

  16. Champer permalink
    October 2, 2018 8:09 am

    “ I found the article interesting , unfortunately inaccurate, I was the first person to drive round the UK and then Iceland in pure Eve’s to disprove range anxiety
    Yes, the UK was straight forward as in was in a Tesla and with the exception of Wales and parts of Scotland there were plenty of charging points and it proved no problem……………….Iceland was different as we used a Nissan leaf and a KIA sole and at the time charging points were as abundant as they are today……………….EV can do a long trips AND some times you have to think ahead but Range Anxiety is in the mind whilst the cost per mile is in the pocket”

    • A C Osborn permalink
      October 2, 2018 11:34 am

      The cost per mile in your pocket is at the expense of everybody who has to pay road tax, which makes EV users, like Solar Panel users PARASITES on the rest of society.
      Once the government starts taxing EVs your smug cost per mile in your pocket will disappear entirely.

      • Japan T permalink
        October 2, 2018 11:55 am

        They are of the, ‘I want, you pay for it’ group. They do not care or worse, are happy that we have to pay for their choices.

      • Champer permalink
        October 5, 2018 2:56 pm

        Totally agree………..And that is why the idea of ev only does not work or renewable fuel only does not work.

        The point I am making is that for many is a good alternative but not every one.

    • Japan T permalink
      October 2, 2018 11:54 am

      Yeah, as long as you only gowhere charging stations are available and they do not already have another ev plugged into them.

      • Champer permalink
        October 6, 2018 10:40 am

        The school run? The office run? shopping……..Yes and charge up at home.

  17. Malcolm Bell permalink
    October 2, 2018 8:43 am

    A Nissan leaf carries a battery that weighs about 600kg – equivalent to eight people. This increases pollution from tyre wear, brake dust and road wear.

    There is no commercial way to recycle these batteries at end of life.

    Huge environmentally ruinous quarties are being ripped in South America, Africa and central Asia to supply the materials to make them and yet the “Leaflets” who drive these cars object to the trivial effects of fracking!

    Group think, no independent thought. The direct result of contemporary education, “just learn what we tell you, if you analyse it you will fail”.

  18. Japan T permalink
    October 2, 2018 9:17 am

    A word on the wrong politicians.

    Recent safety or environmental law/s here in Japan have forced many small volume service stations in rural areas to close. I do not know what specifically the law or laws call for, only that complying with it/them requires a huge outlay of money that service staions that pump below a certain level just can not afford. The results were very visable durring a short road trip this summer. After leaving town, the only gas stations we saw were closed. All of them.

    • October 2, 2018 10:59 am

      Spot any hydrogen filling stations out in the boonies?

      From what you say it’s easy to suspect that tptb are simply prepping the plebs for a change in the way things are….

      • Japan T permalink
        October 2, 2018 11:07 am

        Could be but I suspect it is more likely a case of unintended consequences.

        When choosing between malice or incompetence, the latter is usually the cause. Law makers are so far removed from the realities of the world, they have no clue what their good intentions bring about.

      • October 2, 2018 12:21 pm

        Japan T – as an on the spot observer I feel you’re better informed than me in calling it.

  19. George Lawson permalink
    October 2, 2018 9:24 am

    “While it’s true that sales of electric vehicles rose by 28 per cent in the UK over the first half of this year, that’s tiny compared with Australia, where there has been a 98 per cent rise; Finland, sales have gone up by 148 per cent; and Canada, with a 168 per cent rise.”

    Why do people quote percentages when they don’t give the figures on what the percentage is based upon? ‘A rise of 28 per cent in the UK electric car market’ means absolutely nothing. 28 per cent of what?

    • Harry Passfield permalink
      October 2, 2018 9:37 am

      Dead right, George. Back in the 80s the company where I worked supplied a new IT service. Initially we signed up four clients. A year later we had improved the business 100%. Took a lot longer to make money!

    • October 2, 2018 10:12 am

      Whizzy stats are a specialty of Big Green, so if a country goes from 10 to 50 EVs then that is a 500% increase. WOW, good enough for non-technical journos with tight deadlines.

    • Gerry, England permalink
      October 2, 2018 2:05 pm

      Up to that point I thought the article was good. We all know why she jumped to percentages as if you sell 8 EVs this year after 4 last year that is very good percentage increase for only 4 more cars. Jo Nova has already shown next to no EVs are sold in Australia.

  20. Ian permalink
    October 2, 2018 9:24 am

    It’s not all bad. Anybody who meets these criteria should consider an electric car:

    – Has another means of doing long journeys;
    – can charge offroad;
    – does lots of short journeys.

    I think there’s case for making all school run cars electric. At he moment there seems to be a competition locally to “top that”. Yesterday, I spotted a Range Rover SVR dropping the kiddie off. Made the usual Discos, Q7s, X5s, etc look second class.

    • Japan T permalink
      October 2, 2018 9:53 am

      On the surface, I agree. Fleet vehicles which are only used for short distances and are returned to the lot each day, such as mail and other delivery vehicles and city buses could be a very good use of EVs.

      However, with these and the examples you gave above, we are assuming that there will never be an emergency.

      I was working in Tokyo when the 3/11 earthquake and tsunami hit. Our home just across the river from Tokyo was spared the rolling power outages that lasted for weeks, but only because it happens o be on the same power grid as two massuve bakeries which were operating 24/7 to privide food for the survivors and evacuees. My friends and colleges had all their food spoil in their refridgerators and freezers. The trains were also on rolling black outs, this like could run these days of the week, this line on other days of the week.

      Now imagine if a large portion of all road vehicles in and around Tokyo were EVs. How would we supply the city of 13 million with basic needs. How could any one leave the affected area if all they had was the last charge of the EV. Now imagine if Tokyo itself was hit.

      Not against EVs but am against there being a large percentage of all road vehicles being EVs and dead set against having them forced upon me.

      • Dave Ward permalink
        October 2, 2018 1:05 pm

        “Fleet vehicles which are only used for short distances and are returned to the lot each day, such as mail and other delivery vehicles and city buses could be a very good use of EVs”

        I saw this article the other day:

        http://www.fakenhamtimes.co.uk/news/barsham-brewery-beer-to-be-taken-by-sea-to-bank-house-hotel-1-5708437

        It might seem (on the face of it) to be an “Eco Friendly” solution, but look a the map and you realise it’s nothing more than virtue signalling.
        Barsham to Kings Lynn by road ~ 21 miles
        Barsham to Wells by road ~ 7 miles
        Wells to Kings Lynn by sea ~ 35 miles
        And both ports are tidal with Wells, in particular, being very limited and shallow. Then you have to contend with the North Sea – famous for its ferocity – and the whole exercise seems ridiculous. Driving directly between the brewery and the destination pub wouldn’t take more than an hour at most, and is well within the range of an E-NV200 van, so why would you add at least a day on top (subject to the weather), just so a quayside pub can have its beer delivered by sea? It is just one more example of the absurd efforts some people will go to in order to appear “Green”…

  21. Bitter@twisted permalink
    October 2, 2018 9:40 am

    Personally I think a reasonable case can be made for hybrids.
    Electric mode for short distance (<20 miles) into towns and cities and petroleum/diesel for longer journeys.
    No buttock-clenching panic looking for the next charge point👍

    • Ian permalink
      October 2, 2018 10:18 am

      But not at taxpayers’ expense. Large company car tax breaks for cars such as the Porsche Cayenne. Who needs 455hp?

      • tom0mason permalink
        October 2, 2018 6:24 pm

        “Who needs 455hp?”

        Why the ‘Does my ego look big in this’ crowd of course.

    • Japan T permalink
      October 2, 2018 11:04 am

      If/when they are no more expensive than other vehicles AND we find something to do with the used up batteries, maybe.

  22. October 2, 2018 10:57 am

    In the article and in the comments in the DM there are requests for the government to pay for the charging infrastructure. What they mean is the taxpayer to subsidising their vehicles. If building the infrastructures is economically viable the electricity supply companies would be doing it. Its bad enough that the taxpayer building the Beauly – Denny line for a billion quid without subsidising this nonsense.

    • October 2, 2018 11:03 am

      Putting Count Dracula in charge of the blood transfusion service comes to mind for some reason.

  23. Japan T permalink
    October 2, 2018 11:43 am

    @mf

    Using Simon from Ashby’s numbers,

    “My Local Tesco filling station has 12 pumps. If it takes 5 minutes to fill and pay (slow because they are all pay at pump) then to provide the same through put for 40 minute charges as the petrol pumps there would need to be 96 charging stations.”

    We would also need parking for 96 cars for every 12 pump gas station. As the current travel distance is 160 miles we’d need these every 150 miles or so to be on the safe side. That’s alot of concrete or asphalt. Not a fan of greenery are we, mf?

    But what are the occupants of those 96 EVs going to do during their 40min-14 hour waits?

    Count me out, thank you.

  24. October 2, 2018 12:38 pm

    Every point she made was made prior to the “release” of these “wonder cars.” In fact they were made by people posting on this site.

  25. October 2, 2018 12:54 pm

    Electric cars are a joke without an extender engine. They will be for at least another ten years. Don’t waste your money, your time, and your efforts till they have invented a decent battery which is at least ten years away.

    • Bitter@twisted permalink
      October 2, 2018 2:03 pm

      I wouldn’t hold your breath.
      Fusion has been 20 years away for the last 60 years.
      And unlike fusion, which does show promise, batteries are limited by some well-understood chemistry.
      We can only hope for small incremental increases in efficiency, not a radical new battery, based on some yet, undiscovered electrochemistry.

  26. October 2, 2018 1:44 pm

    How long before vehicle recovery firms refuse flat battery EVs or charge extra – if they don’t already?

  27. George Lawson permalink
    October 2, 2018 4:19 pm

    “In any case, the ‘refuelling’ process could take 13 hours,”

    13 hours?? If half the 1000s of cars that use a busy motorway station were electrically operated, hundreds of recharging positions would need to be provided at every motorway station. And how much longer would you have to wait if all the charging positions were full when you arrived? And if it cost £8 to recharge every 150 miles, this would surely make it more expensive than petrol or diesel.
    One wonders whether Mr Gove’s advisers, in wanting all vehicles to be electric by 2040, have really considered fully the stupidity of their statements, or do silly statements, providing they carry a ‘saving the planet’ label take precedence over simple straightforward logic, logic that is so easy to understand by most sensible thinking people.

    • Dave Ward permalink
      October 2, 2018 5:44 pm

      “One wonders whether Mr Gove’s advisers, in wanting all vehicles to be electric by 2040, have really considered fully the stupidity of their statements”

      I suppose it’s just possible that they know EXACTLY what they are saying, and the real reason for this mad push to get us driving electric cars is that once we (reluctantly) accept the sheer inconvenience of having to make repeated stops, or waiting for ages to charge, we will drastically reduce our car usage. Ergo – the planet is saved!

      • tom0mason permalink
        October 2, 2018 6:31 pm

        And the nation’s productivity will plummet as sooner or later everyone will be stuck with a flat battery.
        Of course you could just take a train, for the same effect.

      • October 2, 2018 10:00 pm

        Gove’s advisors? it’s clear that the DECC eco-crew transferred to BEIS

        “never attribute to malice that which can be blamed on stupidity”

        likely only partially applies

  28. thedude permalink
    October 2, 2018 4:38 pm

    Forgive me if I get the towns or distances wrong here, being a west-coast Yank and all, but something ain’t right here…

    Google Maps says this trip is only 115 miles (fastest route). She says she can charge up at her house, but was looking to “top up” in Cumbria (home town). Cumbria station closed, looking to fill up in Gretna, 37 miles away. Station’s also closed and she’s now out of battery. Someone had to come get her for the remainder of 80 miles, so the math adds up that she was in or just outside of Gretna.

    Either a) the Leaf actually has a 40 mile range, or b) she is blaming the car for her terrible planning.

    I totally agree that EV’s are a complete waste, but this story sounds like BS from a rookie writer trying to make a story.
    “I had to get to the airport 210 miles away, but I only had 2 gallons of gas left. Stupid petrol car! I’mma write an article about it”

  29. October 2, 2018 4:38 pm

    BBC R4 “Costing the Earth” this afternoon was remarkably similar to the Hardman article. Strangely it was not presented by one of the usual Green Nazgool, such as Tom Heap, though the chap was a self-declared Planet Saver.

    Much woe with finding and using charging points. Rather too much airtime given to a zealot, dispensing all the usual conspiracy theories against fossil fuels and car makers. Researchers into batteries gave tempting predictions for future capacity/charge-times, but of course they would anyway.

    Planet Saver Syndrome again on display – oh why is it so hard for us, why won’t the govt force everyone to pay for our green nirvana and clear consciences. The govt is of course fully signed-up, by EU directives.

  30. Malcolm Bell permalink
    October 2, 2018 4:46 pm

    Cumbria is a large ( by English standards) county not a town. Depending where the lady started could mske a difference of plus or minus say sixty miles.

    • thedude permalink
      October 2, 2018 5:15 pm

      (I think you were replying to me)
      That makes more sense. I guess Maps just placed a marker in the geographic center. She did say “south Cumbria”. Although, the furthest-southern town, Rampside, to Gretna is still only 95 miles, but the total trip is now 173 miles. I now chalk this up as “poor planning with an already-handicapped vehicle”.
      Thanks.

    • It doesn't add up... permalink
      October 2, 2018 5:56 pm

      It would be interesting to know how the Leaf fares on a transit of the Hardknott and Wrynose passes, where the gradients are as steep as 1 in 3 in places.

  31. Malcolm Bell permalink
    October 2, 2018 8:21 pm

    I love those roads, if you take take your EV be certain it is fully charged, they haven’t got a charger at the Roman Fort.

    • Dave Ward permalink
      October 2, 2018 9:58 pm

      “Be certain it is fully charged”

      And hope the motor and electronics have good cooling systems! From (rather distant) memory the climb up to the top of each of those passes involves some prolonged low gear work for any normal car. Showing everyone how quickly your EV can get away from traffic lights is one thing, but you don’t want to be the one with an overheated motor/controller blocking a single track road on a hairpin bend…

      • Malcolm Bell permalink
        October 2, 2018 10:12 pm

        That is the ultimate weak point of these vehicles – they don’t have gear boxes so when working hard at low speeds they use high current as the motor turns slowly. High heat generated and fast consumption of the battery charge.

        Yes, I would like to see it done with a fully loaded car. Should work but how many times?

      • October 3, 2018 1:21 pm

        Does not sound as though they are fit for West Virginia roads. In the next county on the way to Blackwater Falls, there is a section with hairpin turns where you can meet yourself coming back. Also pulling up the hill to Aurora is quite the climb and curvy. But when I bought my Ford Freestar van in 2004, I purchased the large engine. The fuel efficiency is not as great, BUT I do not crawl up the hills. In WV there are hills to crawl up everywhere. I can zoom up at the speed limit past the little chuggers.

        They may have the virtue, but I actually arrive at my destination.

      • Malcolm Bell permalink
        October 3, 2018 2:22 pm

        Exactly that.

    • dave permalink
      October 3, 2018 6:41 am

      “They haven’t got a charger at the Roman Fort.”

      A Pict plugged his chariot-lead in backwards and blew the fuses in 424 AD. They sent to Rome for a repairman but you know what it is is with Italians and appointments…

  32. Rudolf Hucker permalink
    October 5, 2018 5:20 pm

    It’s not the chargers that will be the problem in the future,but the lack of electricity to power them!!! Stupid!!!

    • Champer permalink
      October 5, 2018 7:57 pm

      RH , everybody with a brain knows that…………..but that is a political issue Who’s stupid/
      You must be a deluded remainer with that bile.

  33. Rudolph Hucker permalink
    October 5, 2018 9:11 pm

    I am an ardent anti European, in my opinion EU stands for economically useless!

    • Champer permalink
      October 6, 2018 1:57 pm

      Apologies………….so I am i…………the energy has to be from a “balanced grid”………..ie Nuclear and fossil fuels until such time that renewables are effective……the point I have been trying to make is that EV`s are good for a defined role……………
      I would love to take a JCB digger to work and have some fun but it is not practical ………..apart from Fridays!!!!

  34. JCalvertN permalink
    October 5, 2018 9:36 pm

    I’m pretty sure Nissan only ever intended the Leaf to be a local commute and shopping vehicle – never as an inter-state long-hauler. If a Leaf owner wants to go long-distance travelling they ought to a) go by train; b) own another more suitable vehicle – or rent one.

  35. Japan T permalink
    October 6, 2018 1:26 pm

    @camper

    Short runs, yes. But what do you do in the event of an earthquake, or tsunami, or typhoon/hurricane/cyclone? Have two cars, one an ev the other the gas guzzler?

    • Champer permalink
      October 6, 2018 2:01 pm

      Can I buy you a drink?……………………Yes i agree its horses for courses.

      Without being insensitive… if you look at the stats (start on this great website) weather changes have always occurred……………..BUT should we all by a JCB or a CAT?

      • Japan T permalink
        October 6, 2018 3:32 pm

        Yes weather is always an issue. But internal combustion engines are needed in areas without electricity. Being in a large metropolitan area without electricity for long periods of time is no picnic. If I were dependent upon an EV I would have lost even more pay due to not being able to get work. Thankfully we didn’t need to leave the area.

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